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Poster: Time Traveller Date: Dec 18, 2008 6:46pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

I disagree with what the JW say, and I don't like for profit spam, or porn or gambling coming from others.

BUT no way can I agree with JW stuff not being allowed on the Archive, because that's what the Archive is for.

But the minute they begin generating documents especially for the Archive, that's when people should speak out, as then the Archive is being used as a free for them distribution service.

They do have a right to religious freedom to spread their word, but at the same time, the rest of us have religious freedom to speak out and say, WE DON'T want to hear from, or about JW 24/7 on the Archive.

I wonder why they don't fund their own Archive?

This post was modified by Time Traveller on 2008-12-19 02:46:20

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Poster: dudeman5685 Date: Dec 19, 2008 9:20am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

Actually some of what the JWs have to say is kinda interesting. Unlike other Christian sects, they don't believe in an afterlife. They don't participate in politics or the state in any way (juries, military, voting etc.) nor celebrate the usual holidays like Christmas.

They are also strongly anti-Catholic, were persecuted by the Nazis and Fascists, and had a major impact in Northern Rhodesia / Zambia. Their material should provide a new perspective from an often over looked group.

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Poster: Time Traveller Date: Dec 19, 2008 3:28pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

We also have the Exclusive Brethren in NZ, a mate of mine used to work for them, their religion stops them using computer stuff, my mate had to go to another company to make use of fax in and out. however they all had new cars (with computers on the motors) and made use of the telephone. The phone exchange being a computer. however recently they changed that policy.

But to the point, the EB are not allowed to vote in elections, not allowed to be a Member of Parliament.

a few months ago we had a change in Government, Labour out after 4 3-year terms, National in again.

about 4 years ago, National appointed a new leader, Don Brash, who used to be governor of the Reserve Bank. I call him an amateur as he now is totally discredited and out of politics for ever.

While leader of the opposition, somebody leaked some emails of his (they are still looking for the leak)Don Brash was communicating with the EB in the run up to the elections 3 years ago.

And the EB were caught distributing political propaganda on behalf of National.

Labour won another term. And NZ election laws got changed re anonymous donations.

The EB wanted NZ their way, while they can not get into politics, their religion apparently allowed them to do that

If National had got in, and nobody knew about the EB's actions, whom would the National Government have been representing?

The people, or just a few thousand EB?

The JW have extreme views about blood transfusions, even willing to let 2-year kids (Whom don't get to say yes or no themselves)die because of their parents religious views.

Around the world, the JW often are involved in legal action re their kids having blood transfusions.

Who is to know if the JW are involved in politics like the EB in NZ, i am sure the JW would be keen to have the laws changed, so they have the power of life or death over their helpless babies. (most cases, involve simple blood transfusions for a baby, resulting in the baby leading a normal life, but the JW believe such babies should die)

I don't want the JW putting that stuff on the Archive, possibly causing more babies to die, but they do have a right to upload that sort of stuff.

But if they want laws changed, they need to do it openly, and with the consent of the majority

A local horror story, the JW regularly go door knocking, one group had a 2 year old girl in a push chair, she should have been at home playing with other kids and toys.

I got forced to put a sign on my door saying "No salesmen of anything including religion" ("If its free, leave it in my mailbox, you wont need me to sign anything" no real salesmen has ever left me anything in my mailbox)

So the JW still knocked, this time not wanting to talk about JW, but wanting to discuss MY religious beliefs.

Which was none of their business, so I hit the panic button on my security alarm, half the neighbourhood watch came outside to look.

The JW have a really bad name for bothering people, but they don't knock on my door again, because of my alarm.

PS, the notice on my front door, I just decided will be my first upload to the Archive, free for all to use, but must be attributed to Time Traveller on (2-3 days)also a one pager re my religious beliefs, some people say its unique, agreeing with a creator and evolution, but not with an all seeing/knowing God.

This post was modified by Time Traveller on 2008-12-19 23:28:23

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Poster: NathansReader Date: Jan 7, 2009 10:40am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

Yeah, I agree with all the above points of view; the JW should be allowed to have free speech, but I disagree with those views that say to allow them to start generating stuff for IA.

Religious groups come in many flavors, with some being more benevolent and some more malevolent (radical anything), but there are a few in the middle who are trying to take over the world while showing their potential converts that they are a benevolent group.

I was a potential convert once, and I had gotten to the point where I was introduced to some of the more nefarious ideals of the group.

It is wrong to say the JW do not deal in politics; they do it under the table. The JW are actually traitors to any nation they reside in, but noone actually sees that. This is due to their insistence on establishing a global theocracy (see Wikipedia article on WORLD GOVERNMENT) while at the same time they advocate a dissolution of human rights and a deimplementation of global economics.

But then again they claim to be working for human rights, and want a global government. Something not adding up here?

Personally I quit their meetings when I got to the point where I had a conflict of interest.

Do I want to be a pawn for someone else's Earth Empire or do I want to go ahead and try to create my own Earth Empire?

The answer is quite obvious given the fact that I am in college and I grew up on stories of the Roman, Incan, Aztec, and Chinese empires and got really interested in how they formed. (In High School I formed a clique with the intention to create my own cafeteria empire, but that failed due to logistical problems and information control failures...)

For the record, I want to create my own global empire, not be a pawn of someone else's.

Religious groups are generally benevolent, but this one is evil.

That is my personal opinion.

If they upload their stuff here and 100 years into the future a madman reads it, we have the issue of another world empire forming and they don't give a %#$@ about human rights.

For the record, my empire would be a literary and publishing MNC, not a political entity. I do have plans for to establish a world government, but that is not for twelve years. I have to turn 30 and be much more mature before I can go there.

So I want everyone to consider what I have said. Is the JW on IA thing really a good thing, or will we harm somebody in the process of enforcing free speech?

I agree with free speech, but not with allowing enemies of human rights to deceive our youth and convert them to a sinister religion.

Take it from a guy who's been close enough to their group to know about their inner details.

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Poster: Time Traveller Date: Jan 7, 2009 10:25pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

Just to be clear, a little while ago I mentioned the JW generating stuff just for the Archive, I was suggesting that might be their next step, but that I strongly disagreed with them being allowed to do that.

I said their existing stuff was OK, but NOT if they began producing stuff just for the Archive, intending to use the Archive as a free distribution service.

I suppose the rule should be only upload items that are already out in public view, via other means, either hard copy, as in print publications, or publicly shown videos.

And NOTHING for profit

we can not stop JW uploading their existing material, neither can we stop other religions, but if the JW generate stuff especially for the Archive, that's an abuse of their religious legal privileges.

Unfortunately, as more such people learn of the Archive, the more such stuff will be uploaded. it will become another platform for people and groups wanting to be heard, just another political forum etc.

but remember, if the JW has to resort to the Archive to get their message across, it does not say much for their religion, if people don't want to know, the JW forces it onto them anyway. (meaning there will be changes in laws reducing the freedom of religions to spread their message because the JW have abused that freedom.)

In another world, where religion is frowned on, the stuff JW puts out, (not just on the Archive) would be seen as spam, which is, unwanted, unneeded, and unsolicited messages. (if the JW continues how it forces people to listen, the world WILL be forced to change and put restrictions on churches, like in the olden days, when churches commonly abused their privileges and had their sticky fingers in all parts of society, including Government. (the Church of England even tries to dictate how royalty marry and divorce. And where did the Catholic Churches get all their money from?

like I say locally, the JW has a right to spread their message, not by door knocking or stopping me in the street but by the rule, "don't call me, I will call you" a simple card with their phone number or leaflet in my mailbox is okay. (just their methods spreading their word turns people off the JW)

in any case, they always want to personally hand you their printed material, so they can discuss it with you there and then, and is it not the door-to-door salesmen's creed, to get you to sign on the dotted line, BEFORE you get a chance to think about it?

This post was modified by Time Traveller on 2009-01-08 06:25:49

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Poster: NoiseCollector Date: Jan 15, 2009 8:59pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

If they don't believe in the afterlife:

1. What's the point?

2. What is the heaven for the 144,000?

In truth they do not believe in hell (see 1 above) and honestly if I knew there were only 144,000 seats at a concert, I'd stop selling tickets and make sure I got in.

They also don't believe in blood transfusions. My main beef besides not allowing birthdays and christmas for the kids is the prohibition on voting, that can't be productive for anyone who wants to remain in a country that CURRENTLY allows freedom of religion. But to each their own I guess. I wonder how many broke their own rules to vote this time.

That reminds me of the time that they came a knockin' and waking my ass up on saturday morning. I was an HOA member and decided to enlighten them on our soliciting policy in the hood. They told me they were not soliciting.

I said, "Are you offering something?" and they said yes. I said, "Do I have to do anything to get it?" and they said yes. Then I said, "Then get the %^#%$ off my lawn before I call the cops" and they left. It was almost as funny as the time I told them I was a satanist, the looks on their faces was classic.

This is not my lawn and they are not chopping heads off so I agree, let them post!

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Poster: Time Traveller Date: Jan 16, 2009 12:13am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts


please translate HOA for me, I might know already, but can not think of what, now

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Poster: dudeman5685 Date: Jan 16, 2009 6:35am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

Home Owners Association.

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Poster: Time Traveller Date: Jan 16, 2009 1:09pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

Thanks, and of cause you would understand "An Englishman's home is his castle" and you don't want time wasters like the JW with nothing better to do, than door knocking, knocking on your door. Too bad nobody uses boiling oil any more, to discourage unwanted callers.

BTY, in 50-years time, most likely the only way people will know of the JW, is via the archive. they will be extinct because of their refusal to make use of life extending technology such as blood transfusions etc.

And their beliefs on not using technology, if they don't change, means they wont be able to live in tomorrows world, unless they go and find a spare moon or asteroid somewhere.

Some Star Trek stories cover that idea.

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Poster: Sealgaire Date: Jan 16, 2009 9:42pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

First, I am not a JW -- but one of my sisters is. We go a few rounds on "religion" in general every now and again, and we both learn something in the process. Therefor, I do happen to know about some of the "JW beliefs".

They DO allow the use of computers -- PC, Mac, laptops, everything -- because that is where they do most of their current proselytizing, via their websites; it is where my sister gets most of the dis-information about the non-JW world. They are allowed to vote -- but not encouraged to do so. They may not believe in transfusions of NATURAL human blood -- but they do believe in transfusions of MANUFACTURED blood (it's a new technology, still in its infancy - and it doesn't involve real blood...).

What they seem to ignore is that they also break many of their own rules. I have personally witnessed a JW eat a rare, bloody steak -- ignoring the rule against "consuming blood". I have personally heard a JW use derogatory speech in reference to other people -- ignoring the rule against intolerance. There are so many things I have seen and heard, from and by "high-ranking" JWs, there is not enough room here to list them. The JW religious beliefs are no better -- or worse -- than any other set of religious beliefs, and I happen to disagree with any such beliefs which restrict what a person may see, hear, say, do, think, etc.

HOWEVER.... The words in the upper-right corner of the webpage say "Universal access to human knowledge" -- not "...except for what we don't like". If the JWs want to put their propaganda on the pages of this Archive, let them.

The truly intelligent people of the world will recognize the propaganda for what it is -- and they will then ignore it.

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Poster: dudeman5685 Date: Jan 22, 2009 2:31pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

HOWEVER.... The words in the upper-right corner of the webpage say "Universal access to human knowledge" -- not "...except for what we don't like". If the JWs want to put their propaganda on the pages of this Archive, let them.

The truly intelligent people of the world will recognize the propaganda for what it is -- and they will then ignore it.

AMEN! Thats what I have been trying to get across for years.

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Poster: NoiseCollector Date: Jan 17, 2009 11:12pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Jehovas Witness texts

I hate to agree with you but I also know a JW that throws around the N word even though every other JW I ever met was black, they also curse and drink everyday but I beleive you can drink. Shit if you ain't got no birthday presents I would drink too. They are all cults in one way or another.

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